Griffon Lore

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Griffon Lore by Mind Map: Griffon Lore

1. There could be roaming bands of griffon raiders maybe, that would work outside of the law when pony/griffon tensions were high. Like how Queen Elizabeth hired pirates to fuck with other countries? Could explain some of it.

1.1. I like that idea can we use that? I was also thinking that some movement in the kingdom would be xenophobic dissdents that focus primiarly on antipony sentiments and try to cuase trouble with the Equestrians

1.1.1. Yeah that could be true. If we wanted to make a religious aspect we could turn that faction as ones who oppose belief in Celestia/Luna as the goddesses who make the sun and moon rise, which I think could add some interesting plot.

2. Unlike ponies, griffons have predator aspects of both birds of prey and of big cats. This means that they wouldn't be a hunter-gatherer species in as much as the 4c ponies, nor would they be simple farmers like canonical ponies are either. Instead they would go after animal protein, which would be considerably smaller than pony sized. I think bugs, being one of the easiest creatures to produce in massive quantities, could be one such 'livestock' for them, as well as fish and things like rabbits, shrews, squirrels.

3. All personal head canon but i see ponies as more condensed while griffons often will spread out and make new settlements, roughly same population but griffons enjoy a more personal/exclusive life while ponies like sociable places

3.1. I think categorizing them as completely lone living creatures would be wrong though, because lions live in prides and birds tend to flock with preybirds being the exception. I guess it can go both ways.

3.1.1. not all alone but they do prefer to live in a small town rather than a large city

4. Clouds and mountains?

5. Northern Section of Kingdom centers on two dynamic warrior types heavily diciplined warrior formation with legion corhorts that feature reckless beserkers which works as the armies heavy hitters when exhausted taken into cover by other legions

5.1. I'd like to think trade would be a major component, maybe minerals such as gold/silver/ingots would have higher value because it seems like most griffons wouldn't be miners.

5.2. so hard set in a warrior race, best fighter rules kind of thing?

5.2.1. If using 2 kingdoms idea they also have an educated elite class and test potential rulers in both areas, if using ~Sith then warriors are best. If using clan idea then yes to strength again.

5.3. If Griffons recognized the power of the Royal Sisters I think they could have pagan celebrations or sacrifices in maybe something like a Stonehenge or temple setting? Or would they have their own deities if any?

5.3.1. they can recognize their power but not follow, they just may worship power in a way, like worshiping Talos

5.3.1.1. Would they give tithes to the pony rulers then? Or maybe there would be some sort of ceremonial exchange where both parties exchange something of value.

5.3.1.1.1. a ceremony could work, both sides show respect for the other culture, possibly see ponies as weak creatures but also not worth their time

6. First subject that was given on the thread? What would you rather talk about?

7. Due to race division (See: Biological Variation), geography (See: Geography and Geopolitical Landscape) and culture (See: Culture) - lands would require a government that has capability to uphold order for apex-predator based society. Thus monarchy/high monarchy is a viable choice. A structure akin to HRE or Byzantine Empire can sprawl through lands with a focus put on central authority in the middle of it all. Multiple regions in the north-east are collectively combined into Northern Kingdom/Region which combines towns/settlements that were raised out of original Northern Kingdoms and clans; Southern region might have had several smaller 'kingdom'-like entities that were included into system, but due to their remoteness and generally alien environment, the government's hold here would be the weakest. Thus everything revolves around militaristic/traditionalist (and perhaps xenophobic) north and politically powerful central-west cosmopolitan region that combines all under more-or-less one banner. High King and royal lineage in this case play a vital lore, with capital's court being quite diverse and made out from Northern, Central and (to a much lesser degree) Southern gryphons. Regions are divided into provinces with thanes and their courts tasked to 'Mayor/oversee' things around. Some problematic parts might have heavily appointed leadership while culturally progressive towns and provinces having citizens vote/take duty in local institutions. Even with this - central government would still play a major role in sustaining balance between different cultures.

8. Since we can't make direct allusions to show canon I guess NPCs go here. I don't think we would deal with any griffons who weren't nomadic and would probably fall beneath the notice of ranked griffons / be discouraged from relations due to the Royal sisters warning against us.

9. I think griffons are less populous than ponies though, but it's hard to tell from show canon. I'd think there would be more pony land holdings filling their potential niches?

10. Sociology?

10.1. The Northern kingdom is where military training, trade guilds, and diplomatic missions would occur and also where foreigners would approach to deal with griffons. The Southern kingdom is more griffon exclusive and has more to do with leisure, individual craftsman and artisan shops, and educational facilities. The griffons would then present themselves as overly military focused brutes to other races but also have their own educated elite that deal with strategy.Not all griffons choose to live in griffon society however, but they aren't seen as outcasts.

10.1.1. Idea of being like Egypt Vikings with the Norht and South Kingdoms, possible feifdoms as well with barons that help elect the new king if ned be

10.1.1.1. Where is the the Roman/egypt shizz coming from?

10.1.1.1.1. Someone suggested it in the thread as a tl;dr. I prefer it to generic vikings though.

10.1.1.1.2. Roman due to meditarianian and egypt due to the whole North and South Kingdom idea

10.1.2. If expanding on geopolitical aspect (North-East/Central-West, South vs North & South) and 'similarities' with some gryphs looking 'French', I'd say the Central-West one (with access to the ocean) would be more diplomacy+trade guilds+culture+livestock farming. These would embody Central-Mediterranean European cultures, including imprints on military. Central areas are more 'gryphon exclusive' than Western due to those valleys being cut off by high mountain ranges on which 'western' 'citadel cities' reside. North-Eastern: military focus in everything + Norse/Viking inclinations.

11. Physiology

11.1. So does that mean they have a gizzard?

12. Culture

12.1. Gilda = viking name

12.1.1. I'd be cool with a Viking/Roman mix.

12.1.1.1. I think given the mythological origin of the Gryphon as a creature, Greek or roman cultures are probably the most likely, and these cultures have influenced enough others for diverse names like Gilda to be acceptable.

12.1.1.1.1. And Italy branched from Greco-Roman cultures so I can see it making sense. They're also in Egyptian/Persian art too though and anglosaxons kind of adopted them after Roman occupation.

12.1.2. Gilda isn't just used for anglo-saxons, but also in Germanic cultures and Italian.

12.2. Livestock farmers for small animals with an average rank in society, and ranked below them would be griffons who farm the sustenance given to maintain the animal farms (alternatively, this is where griffon and pony interaction could have developed as ponies supply the 'lesser' feed for the griffon farming). These farms would be central to the hub cities of the griffons, but many griffons in the wild could stake their own territory to live either alone or with a mate / offspring as long as the area could support them as apex predators.

12.2.1. So North = Mammalian farms, and South = crustaceans and fish? With trading being done for what's at the bottom of the food chain like wheat.

12.2.1.1. Griffons could also trade furs if ponies wouldn't look down on that in exchange for other vanity items such as precious metals and minerals.

12.3. Gaston is French

12.4. Roman gov't, Viking culture and language, Egyptian religion?

12.5. Griffon Graveyard

12.5.1. Yes ther is infact currently not doing anything with it at the moment as I was unsure of treading on the whole subject of griffon lore as well as keeping the people in town unupset with my idea with it, its in the first mine actually the iron one.

12.5.1.1. Since I don't actually know the details behind it what was described when it was discovered, to avoid retconning? Just bones? Coffins? Death masks, casts or sarcophagi? It would be cool if, since it was underground, was maybe a prison or penal colony that disaster struck. But if there were actual burial signs we can work off that.

12.5.1.1.1. Imagine a death city where the entire settlement was of the Farbeak clan that was attempting to clear the way for the empire back then it didnt get retconed only that the Thane asked for the players to bury the entrance they had accidently dug into.

13. Geography and Geopolitical Landscape

13.1. If working off the North/South kingdom idea, then the North kingdom would be in the taiga biome most likely and the South in a maritime location, So north = mountains, forests and South = grassland, coastal regions.

13.2. Northern section would be mountainous highlands with easiy to defend peaks and small mountain passes that make importing diffcult usually by passed by cloud ship which is forged in ship buildingyards that are capable of holding solid goods that dont have cloud walking ability

13.3. Northern-eastern biome: taiga, tundra, frozen plains, high and low mountain peaks - land of Northern Kingdom and subservient clans. Populated mostly by 'Northern' gryphons. Central-western: temperate climate, plains, grasslands and high/low mountains: land of 'Central' gryphons and with predominant kingdom in the region - holds the capital city and central authority around entire 'Gryphonia'/Gryphon lands - 'High King' and his Court in the mountainous metropolitan citadel - Gryphus (taking existing naming there, heh, but generally can be anything). Southern lands: deserts, marshes, jungles, tropical biome: land of 'Southern' Gryphons: small tribes, warbands, communities - generally scarce and weak, but difficult to manage. Combined kingdom of northern and central gryphons might have a problem with this region.

13.3.1. Thought we were going along the lines of the North being the hardy area of the kingdoms but the South would be where the univesities, arts and places for the older birdes to retire would be at?

13.3.1.1. It's an expansion of said idea in which 'Gryphonia's hold is expanded to tropical scene. In this case we have North-East (hardy area, hardy gryphons, fierce military, Norse + Spartan culture that revolves around strength, warrior code and honor), Central-West (West = access to ocean meaning trade hub, cultural exchange, more 'trade'-inclined gryphs. Central area might have more lush valleys meaning farms/pastures (for animals) between high mountains on which cities with universities, arts, other trade hubs, guilds and such might be located. Central-West: 'culture' and 'politics' inclined focus due to milder environment that doesn't revolves on harsher survival) and South (Scarce, spread-out population, different cultures, inclinations between Egyptian (as was suggested), Nubian and tribal cultures. Marshes, deserts and jungles make establishing hold in it for North/Central gryphs a problem due to differences in environments. This area would host exotic-looking 'native' gryphs)

13.4. Southern section can be located on an island maybe, or located built into the side of a coastal cliff (like Mesa Verde IRL).

13.4.1. That could work or have it be like valleys that they have colonized in a large strecth of land to their south possibly like Italy or the greek area

13.4.1.1. I'd like that, just have to make sure the biome is one that supports tons of prey (and the Mediterranean works really well for that). I think going for savannah plains wouldn't be so good though since most birds in those regions are ones who eat carrion rather than fresh meat.

14. Government

14.1. Lands can possibly be ruled over by different clans of griffons. the clans holding more land would have more influence from wealth, military power, culture, science.

14.1.1. think of the sith empire from Star wars lore for a basis

14.1.1.1. During which time period? Sith have been through a lot.

14.1.1.1.1. during the attack of the old republic, under the emperor that was ~1000 SWTOR MMO era

14.2. Basing some of this off corvid and lion prides it could also be possible to assume that there is an advisory council to the royal family of griffons, but positions are not held for life. Similarly the royal lineage can change hands when all existing members are deceased, and the right of rule goes through an individual that must pass trials of both the North and South kingdoms relating to physical prowess and intellectual capacity. Granted, council griffon's families or distant relations from the previous royal family are given first notice of the test (and so have an advantage of preparation), but the test is extended to all kingdom wide so as to keep the gene pool diverse / prevent interbreeding.

15. Major Characters? Political Sense?

15.1. over monarch, with heads ruling over other areas. The stronger the better when picking/ challenging a ruler for a seat of power

16. With all these details on Gryphons, is this going to be all NPCs or are we leading to roll-able characters?

16.1. Probably not playable, but maybe NPCs or quests involving them could happen. Isn't there a griffon graveyard somewhere?

16.2. possible controllable NPC, maybe trips can get gryphon choice

16.2.1. I wish crystal ponies could be given over them

16.2.1.1. trips could be given the choice of crystal/gryphon or it could be unicorn/crystal [also need to change rolling structure for race]

16.2.1.1.1. Yeah I think so as well, as race divisions are given now it's too imbalanced, too many earthies.

16.3. Controllable non-cannonite NPCs and expanding gryphon lore (considering that fact that Farbeak clan's burial site is located right north of the town in mountains + entire 'Griffon vs. Deer' party that ran away from Gryphon lands after they were surrounded by other gryphs - expanding these parts would be good): yes yes and yes; Roll-able characters: no.

17. Biological Variation

17.1. they are half eagle, half lion

17.1.1. Perhaps variations in the feline/avian parts can be based on their location or land of origin? Griffons from more tropical environments, for example could be a jaguar/macaw fusion.

17.1.1.1. I can get behind this idea

17.1.2. Maybe doesn't have to be Eagle, could be Owl, Hawk, parrot (pfft) etc.

17.1.2.1. Maybe the big cat part can also vary, like jaguar/panther/leopard. Snow leopard/snow owl griiffons would be pretty badass.

17.1.2.1.1. And the snow leopard and bob cat for the more wintery aspect? Could work I think

17.1.2.2. could differ due to multiple generations from different areas, parrot griffons live in tropical etc...

17.2. One of the older 'headcanon' tropes that are usually used in case of gryphons is variation by race 'types' that are determined by geography, splitting them into 3 biome. Northern gryphons are described as more predatory, bulky and savage-looking/intimidating/imposing (doesn't means that they are uncultured), with northern heavily mountain-esque biome creatures used for their base - snow leopard/cougars/northern lynxes [for valley types], falcons/owls. Central gryphons are less bulky/slender and resemble those that we see in the show - lions/cheetahs/leopards & eagles/hawks. Southern (tropical) types are the rarer ones and are most alien looking (and acting) - jaguars/panthers/tigers & macaw/parrots

17.2.1. Would griffons discriminate against each other based on how they look? Would ponies? I imagine if there was a buzzard / lynx there might be some odd looks.

17.2.1.1. odd looks like an African tribe seeing a white man for the first time but not discrimination, very exotic but not hated

17.2.1.2. The continuation of this 'trope' is that yes, they there 'was' discrimination at some point of time that brought numerous wars. Differences in their mentality (geography/environment playing a key role) and different 'looks' setting them up for this (northern: aggressive/traditionalists/more barbarian clan-like structure; central: more cosmopolitan/cultured/adapting; southern: isolationists/survivalists/tibalists/worshipers), Some 'discrimination' might be there, but this is a different matter. At this point it is downplayed/was settled through time.

17.2.1.2.1. So with regards to what 4c could expect for griffon dealings, would they be grouped together into a unified Kingdom or still be segregated into hub cities without a central location for governing?

17.3. Griffons would probably be K selected when it comes to reproduction, so 1-2 small eggs that have parental care until adolescence, then the offspring can choose to leave or stay with their family?

17.3.1. Since it wasn't clear why this was brought up it's an indication of longevity, high survivorship through birth - adolescence - adulthood with death at "old age." Which begs the question of whether griffons or ponies have the longer lifespan.

17.4. Generally big cat males tend to have dimorphism in that males are larger than the females, but females are more attuned to hunting. Bird females are also dimorphic but size usually favors the female bird while male birds are more inclined to have showy features for mating. Inb4 females ruling everything ala feminism in MLP :^)

18. Griffon Abilities?

18.1. Probably no magic users as potent as unicorns, alchemists ~ to zebras? if any?

18.1.1. Possibly shamanistic elements for the Southern exotic lands, more classical Druidic influence in North, and science-based alchemists in Central

18.1.2. Maybe calling on whatever powers that be to help them in aid. If we are going the viking route anyway

18.1.2.1. In regardas to the viking rote there are shamens that have rune based magic in so far as was infereed from the Farbeak clan some cunteries ago.

18.1.2.2. Vikings are just so boring and overdone in my opinion.. But it seems to be one of the more predominant ideas. Not everything has to be a 1:1 match up of human culture though.